Author: flotsam

Katrina and the Waves [Copy link] 中文

Rank: 4

Post time 2005-9-1 23:09:26 |Display all floors

Abject indifference? But the truth is truth.

The conclusion of Conchis seems more astonishing than what has astonished him. Natural disasters happen everywhere, the worst was the tsunami 8 months ago. But man-made disasters induced by US seems ongoing since the last few decades, perhaps longer, but the clarity of its disastrous administration has just become more and more apparent since Bush taking office. Many have been awed to numbness by the injustice and cruelty inflicted by Bush's administration.
Surely we feel the sympathy for the affected people in New Orleans, but somehow, emotions sometimes get disturbed for the fact that among this group could be the very people who supported Bush's foreign policy. Though I heard the French quarter is quite anti-Bush.

You must have been aware, the event that killed up to a thousand of Iraqis yesterday, as a result of chaos & insecurity caused by the US invasion, more heart wrenching than what we can curse this nature's fault brought by hurricane.

What doesn't help is the facts that those looters expose the worst in human being at times of crisis in a country that always point their lecturing finger at others. On TV, it showed the police helped themselves freely to goods from the store with a trolley, a white lady even said she was authorized by police to loot, while on the other scene, the white police was pointing guns at the black looters.

Instead of wagging tongue at Flotsam's comment, you should condemn these acts too. I wonder why there “was not a word of criticism” on this hypocrisy.
Flotsam has correctly pointed out the hypocrisy practiced by US, especially the US government and its administration by using some analogy, he didn't make sinister comments regarding the sufferers.

People who are in US should learn some foreign languages to read what have all been written about Bush and its administration, even at this critical time in his government, most press focus on the chaos on oil, Iraq, world trade, human loss, poverty caused by US rather than the victims of this hurricane. Someone just told me the shares price in cement industry has just gone up a few notches to anticipate the need for reconstruction in New Orleans. Soon you'll see how others learn the US tactics to profit on other country's catastrophe, eg, Iraq-Halliburton.

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Post time 2005-9-2 07:13:22 |Display all floors

Nothing but criticism. NOT Astonishing!

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Post time 2005-9-2 07:23:39 |Display all floors

The Gas and Oil Party only care about cold hard cash.

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Post time 2005-9-2 10:52:52 |Display all floors

"Though I heard the French quarter is quite anti-Bush"

Vivoix,

Just to get it out of the way first, in no way am I a supporter of Bush, his policies or his "messianic" clarity, etc., and  I am not, and have never been, a supporter of the invasion of Iraq or of Bush and his cronies' subsequent bungling of the entire affair. Nor have you ever seen me posting in defense of the actions of the US in Iraq or elsewhere overseas, even in the face of constant US/UK baiting by the resident half-wit Flotsam, despite the fact that the posting on this site is so one sided in that regard.

Why?  Because I mostly agree with the criticism, at least in principle, if not always in substance. The US (we) screwed up. Royally. Less than 4 years ago (right after Sept 11), most of the world, and certainly the West, sympathized with the US, and was prepared to support SOME sort of response.  Yet our administration frittered it away out with some misguided concept of rearranging the world order through military intervention.  And others are paying the ultimate price for Bush's screw ups. So worldwide bitterness, and certainly bitterness from the Iraqis, is well earned.

I suppose I could argue the other side to the issues here, and perhaps more posters should to balance this board out a little bit, but my heart wouldn’t  really be in making some abstract political realist analysis in the face of such suffering.

I will say a couple things, though, in response to your statement: "eople who are in US should learn some foreign languages to read what have all been written about Bush and its administration, even at this critical time in his government, most press focus on the chaos on oil, Iraq, world trade, human loss, poverty caused by US rather than the victims of this hurricane."  

Well, no doubt it would be nice if people in the US learned more languages. It's funny, though, that people on this board are very fond of pontificating about how biased the US news reports are, and how the US media establishment manipulates the US citizenry into supporting the war and being nationalistic.  But isn't it also the case that non-US media in other countries is using admittedly readily available horrific imagery from Iraq for their own ends, that have NOTHING to do with sympathy for the Iraqi people, and everything to do with manipulating their own people?  Don’t most governments, in particular government sponsored media, ALWAYS like to distract their citizens from what the government is doing (or failing to do) on the home front, while blaming the world's ills, and those of their own citizenry, on someone else?

I bet if you picked up a newspaper in any middle eastern country, or Latin America (particularly Venezuela), the front page will almost always be about Iraq.  Well, OK, in China it will often be a picture of some silly beauty contest in Jilin Provicince. But for the politically oppressed and impoverished in other countries, like Iran, what is really more important for them - more Iraq coverage of misery (with lots of close ups of American soldiers in menacing poses) or a little more media analysis of their own pretty fu*&$ed up situation and the national funds that are being siphoned off by the elite?  And if non-US media in more developed countries really is just interested in increasing awareness of human suffering, then why all the focus on Iraq, with even larger humanitarian disasters unfolding in the Sudan and Niger? You mention the tsunami.  Where is all the media coverage now?  As if the problems and suffering there had gone away. Guess what?  The US media, which at least isn't government owned and operated, isn't the only one doing the manipulating.

I hope that I never become so disenchanted with any slice of humanity that the following phrase could come so easily from my lips: "Surely we feel the sympathy for the affected people in New Orleans, but somehow, emotions sometimes get disturbed for the fact that among this group could be the very people who supported Bush's foreign policy. Though I heard the French quarter is quite anti-Bush." Great. Well, maybe if you are lucky there will be another couple natural disasters (or even better - a big terrorist attack!) and Bush's largely uneducated bible thumping electoral base will be whittled down so that the Democrats can win the next election. That sounds like a civilized way of looking at the world, one which Flotsam would ascribe to.  

Funny, though - whacky as the bible-belt Christian fundamentalists supporting are that make up a good portion of Bush's constituency, at least none of them had your reaction when the tsunami hit Aceh province (mostly Muslim) or the earthquakes hit Iran (Muslim). Their first reaction, like yours (I think) was one of sympathy, and desire to help.  The situation in New Orleans will become political soon enough once the finger pointing you are talking about really kicks in.  Then you and your buddy Flotsam can really have your fun.

As for the looting comment, well, I haven't seen the images you reference, but I heard about them. But I think that some more analysis should go into the picture before the race card is pulled, though it likely plays a role, being the South. I believe (though I cant confirm) that a decision was made fairly early by the authorities that they did not have the resources in place to deal with both rescue operations and a 100,000 people without food or water, particularly when the real disaster didn’t strike until after the hurricane when the levies broke. So I believe that police decided to permit some self help (looting) due to expediency. But very quickly some opportunistic folks decided to take advantage of the situation, and of that group, most of them were black guys armed with guns from what I hear.  So the situation got out of hand (with images all over the globe) and police hhad to reestablish order. One police officer was shot, and that alwayas escalates the situation.  So I can see why the police might be a little less accomodating to a group of black guys taking things then they might be of one lone white woman in the early going.

Conchis

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Post time 2005-9-2 12:26:51 |Display all floors

flotsam...where do you get your information?

Hurricane Katrina didn't form off of Africa months (or even weeks) ago.  You can read about the origins of Katrina here: http://msnbc.msn.com/id/9120096/

NBC News
Updated: 6:34 p.m. ET Aug. 29, 2005

"Katrina will be a storm for the record books. It first appeared a week ago — not off the coast of Africa like many hurricanes — but near the Bahamas, very close to the United States."

"That, according to Max Mayfield, director of the National Hurricane Center, is not unusual."

"There's no rule that says tropical cyclones have to form in the far eastern Atlantic," he says. "I wish they did. That would give us a lot more time."



Whenever you post inaccurate information you remind us all to ALWAYS use more than one source of information.   Thanks

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Post time 2005-9-2 20:51:12 |Display all floors

Burning, explosion and gunfight broke out in the French Quarters, New Orleans !

New Orleans has decended into lawlessness and a refugee city with still tens of thousands of blacks and poor white, elderly, sick American stranded there.

Is this the end of the American Empire?

The major problem is the US Army Corps of Engineers failed to make a real assessment of the effect of heavy rain in the Pontchartrain Lake and the rise of the level of water in the Pontchartrain Lake and caused actually three (not reported as two) levees to break through and flood the entire city (over 80%) in New Orleans and failure to mount a co-ordinated rescue effort to get the citizen of the "paper tiger" America out from the New Orleans Superdome and the Convention center and reasulted in thousands and thousands death due to negligence !
20050902205111b4.jpg

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Post time 2005-9-2 20:55:52 |Display all floors

Hurricane Katerine did not make a direct hit at New Orleans but Gulfport, MY HOM

To make everyone aware, I am from Gulfport, Mississippi, raised there, grew up there, worked there.

the last hurricane was Camille in 1969, 36 years ago which actually swirled around the coast and turned around and hit the Mississippi coast 36 years ago.

But this time, it is a direct hit right between Missisippi and Lousiana and not a direct hit on New orleans. The problems of New Orleans is actually the pressure become so strong in Pontchartrain lake and broke three levees and caused massive flooding in new Orleans !

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