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Post time 2012-4-26 22:37:47 |Display all floors
This post was edited by Transhumanism at 2012-4-26 22:41
lebeast Post time: 2012-4-26 22:25
The genes are actually useful in certain circumstances and an attempt at "genetic hygiene" will fa ...

I understand your concern that eliminating psychopathology genes may have unforseeable negative consequences.  Personally, I'm convinced, based on the research I've read, that eliminating psychopathology will be a good thing.  We will have no more lying self-serving politicians, no more white collar crimes, and no more blue collar crimes.  People will be more responsible, more altruistic, and more concerned about their society and the people that comprise it.

Regarding the claim that diversity is a strength, I will do the annoying act of posting a link to a video I recently watched by Jared Taylor: Youtube.com/watch?v=8P1leFIavw4&feature=channel&list=UL

Posting a link is the lazy way, but I'm now tired.
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Post time 2012-4-26 23:00:17 |Display all floors
MisterPanda Post time: 2012-4-26 22:27
I agree with you that science is influenced by politics, the most famous example is certainly Gali ...
However, I do believe much more in the social bagage than in some kind of
genetic baggage considering behaviour.

Actually, genetics account for 50% of behavior: the rest is environment.  So, we are both correct.  We need to improve both environment and genetics to achieve the best results.  Since much emphasis is placed on the environmenal improvements, I wanted to stress the genetic improvements.


Human beings are before everything mammals, and no mammal is born bad. We just
become bad.
I think "Bad" and "good" are subjectvie terms.  I instead use the phrases "desirable behaviors" and "undesirable behaviors," desirable and undesirable being defined by a specific culture, or even by individuals, and the definitions will vary based on varying ethics of individuals and socieities.


Maybe the answer is in philosophy and not in science. Jean-Jacques Rousseau said
"all humans are born good, it is society that perverts them".
I prefer the methodology of Evolutionary Psychologists.


If we follow your logic, the criminals are not responsible for their acts as
they had no choice but to behave the way they did. In which case punishing them
makes no sense. This is why I can't abide by your logic.

Genes influence the behaviors of the criminals, so to reduce the occurrences of the crimes, we need to eliminate the psychopathic genes. And, gene or no gene, the perpetrator needs to be separated from society to prevent the reoccurance of the crime. But your comment is interesting: if a person has a genetic predisposition for crime, should he be dealt with more mercifully? Well, I don't support torture either way, and I don't support the Western prison system which are defacto torture camps. But in the end, the goal is to prevent the reoccurrence of crime.
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Post time 2012-4-26 23:35:31 |Display all floors
Transhumanism Post time: 2012-4-26 23:00
Actually, genetics account for 50% of behavior: the rest is environment.  So, we are both correct ...
Genes influence the behaviors of the criminals, so to reduce the occurrences of the crimes, we need to eliminate the psychopathic genes. And, gene or no gene, the perpetrator needs to be separated from society to prevent the reoccurance of the crime. But your comment is interesting: if a person has a genetic predisposition for crime, should he be dealt with more mercifully? Well, I don't support torture either way, and I don't support the Western prison system which are defacto torture camps. But in the end, the goal is to prevent the reoccurrence of crime.


You actually mention this also
Actually, genetics account for 50% of behavior: the rest is environment.  So, we are both correct.  We need to improve both environment and genetics to achieve the best results.  Since much emphasis is placed on the environmenal improvements, I wanted to stress the genetic improvements.


Meaning that, by your logic, the child of 2 criminals have, at most, 50% chance of not being a criminal (50% genetics = he's a criminal, 50% environment = he might not be a criminal).

Therefore, why punish someone who didn't do anything wrong just based on the fact that there is a chance he might do something wrong ? That's where your genetic theory finds a limit, by punishing someone who didn't do anything wrong you commit yourself a criminal act.

Well, I don't support torture either way, and I don't support the Western prison system which are defacto torture camps. But in the end, the goal is to prevent the reoccurrence of crime.


We agree on that.

I would also like to point the risk of error. There have been several high end cases that showed the justice system made a wrong decision by incarcerating an innocent. If said innocent was killed, this is a tragedy !
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Post time 2012-4-27 02:43:49 |Display all floors
This post was edited by Transhumanism at 2012-4-27 02:52
MisterPanda Post time: 2012-4-26 23:35
You actually mention this also

Meaning that, by your logic, the child of 2 criminals have, at  ...
Meaning that, by your logic, the child of 2 criminals have, at most, 50% chance
of not being a criminal (50% genetics = he's a criminal, 50% environment = he
might not be a criminal).

Therefore, why punish someone who didn't do
anything wrong just based on the fact that there is a chance he might do
something wrong ? That's where your genetic theory finds a limit, by punishing
someone who didn't do anything wrong you commit yourself a criminal act.

By sterilizing psychopaths, we overall reduce the incidences of crime.  The overall and long-term good is served.  It's about chances/probability, not absolutes.   And keep in mind, I am only referring to China.  I understand that whites have a different ethical system, and I do not wish to push my ideas on them: I am happy with the way they are.  In white countries, psychopaths, on average, have more children than non-psychopaths.  But the whites believe that the "reproductive rights" of criminals/psychopaths take precedence over the  "collective rights" of whites to be free of crime.   

I would also like to point the risk of error. There have been several high end
cases that showed the justice system made a wrong decision by incarcerating an
innocent. If said innocent was killed, this is a tragedy !

Yes, some innocents may be given the death penalty, but I am okay with that, since the overall and long term good is served, or good as I believe it to be.
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Post time 2012-4-27 02:48:29 |Display all floors
This post was edited by FreddyAguilar at 2012-4-27 02:49

The "hobby" of the future:




"cross-breeding" humans like roses or tulips.




The "Monsanto" of Human genetics



HARMONY


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Post time 2012-4-27 02:52:38 |Display all floors
This post was edited by Transhumanism at 2012-4-27 03:01

I understand that whites have a different ethical system, and I do not wish to push my ideas on them: I am happy with the way they are.  In white countries, psychopaths, on average, have more children than non-psychopaths.  But the whites believe that the "reproductive rights" of criminals/psychopaths take precedence over the  "collective rights" of whites to be free of crime.  Therefore, white countries will have increasily higher and higher amounts of crime, as is currently evident when we look at crime statistics over the past generations.   
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Post time 2012-4-27 02:55:21 |Display all floors
FreddyAguilar Post time: 2012-4-27 02:48
The "hobby" of the future:

That is a different topic, and if you start a unique thread on it, I would be happy to discuss it.  But for now, I am talking about simply sterilizing all psychopaths in China.  
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