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betrayed
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British, French nuclear subs crash in Atlantic

British, French nuclear subs crash in Atlantic

LONDON– A British and a French submarine, both of them nuclear-powered and carrying nuclear weapons, collided in the Atlantic Ocean earlier this month, the Sun newspaper reported on Monday.

File picture shows the French submarine Triomphant which reportedly collided earlier this month with a British submarine in the Atlantic.

The tabloid said HMS Vanguard and France's Le Triomphant were both damaged in the incident, but there were no reports of damage to the nuclear sections of either vessel. The British sub has now been towed to Faslane in Scotland for repair.

Both vessels - between them carrying about 250 sailors - were reportedly submerged and on separate missions when they crashed on February 3 or 4.

The British submarine HMS Vanguard

The Ministry of Defence refuses to comment on submarine operations but a spokesman said: "We can confirm that the UK's deterrent capability has remained unaffected at all times and there has been no compromise to nuclear safety."

HMS Vanguard, launched in 1992, is a Vanguard class SSBN (Ship Submersible Ballistic Nuclear) vessel, one of four such submarines tasked with maintaining the country's independent nuclear deterrent. The vessel has 16 missile tubes capable of firing the Trident II D5 missile. Each missile can deliver up to 12 warheads.

Triomphant, launched in 1994, is one of four Triomphant Class submarines serving with the French Navy. It carries 16 M51 SLBM missiles and forms part of France's nuclear deterrent force.

2009-2-16 10:21 PM

betrayed
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09-2-16 22:21 by Betrayed

one disaster after another

2009-2-17 10:13 AM

betrayed
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Image Attachment: 0013729e4a600b0346763d.jpg (2009-2-17 10:15 AM, 12.57 K)

2009-2-17 10:15 AM

betrayed
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Image Attachment: 0013729c04950b0359ce51.jpg (2009-2-17 10:18 AM, 51.72 K)

2009-2-17 10:18 AM

betrayed
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2009-2-16 22:21

is the answer to the second question

2009-2-17 10:19 AM

betrayed
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Russian and USA satellites crash in space

a day or so later

French and English subs crash in an Ocean

it says a lot for the guidance systems oin the French and English subs

what if they both hit a Russian sub or a Chinese sub

do we all get a war

?

2009-2-17 11:11 AM

mengzhi (mengzhi)
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Low Tech method required .

And we have been brain washed into thinking that the West have precision communication direction , dead-eyed weaponry and some " invincibility " . Now we are told ( belatedly ) that two nuclear subs collided in the middle of the Atlantic Ocean !!

Imagine , even if you want to collide deliberately , to do it successfully in mid Atlantic and at depth is a billion to one . What happened to the radar , or the smoke signal gadget ? I suggest ( just a suggestion ) that a shark proof cage to constructed outside the subs and a sailor ( their lives are cheap ) be stationed there with a torch and knock on the hull if another submarine comes into view . This will prevent the next collision , which could have been a disaster with the nuclear weapons on board .

Here is a box of tissues , wipe those eggs off the British and French naval faces please .

2009-2-17 02:12 PM

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2009-2-17 07:53 PM

yasawakic
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Last news: froggies stuff REALLY didnt detect (heared) the rosbeef sub and so the rosbeef stuff.

2009-2-17 08:23 PM

#10

betrayed
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I suppose that is one way to look at it

EXCELLENT STEALTH

2009-2-17 10:49 PM

#11

idiot8
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QUOTE:

Originally posted by mengzhi at 2009-2-17 14:12
And we have been brain washed into thinking that the West have precision communication direction , dead-eyed weaponry and some " invincibility " . Now we are told ( belatedly ) that two n ...

If the subs were nuclear armed the high tech capability they posses is to be silent and invisible. Nuclear armed subs are famously unmanuerable because of the number of missiles they carry and the silence they are required to keep. They also tend to seek out out of the way places to try and stay hidden. If two of them ran into each other it is a case of two blind kids (blind because nuclear subs are invisible) playing hide and seek against the russians. They both then found the same hiding place and ran into each other.

2009-2-17 11:56 PM

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betrayed
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2009-2-18 06:57 AM

#13

mengzhi (mengzhi)
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What a clanger !!

Tweedle dee & Tweedle dum ( aka naive & idiot ) are so keen to whitewash this shameful and embarrassing episode they have come to resort to the Sci-fi myths and bedtime stories .

IF these sophisticated nuclear subs from France and UK are high tech and thus " silent and invisible " they should be invisible ONLY to the enemy right ? To be invisible to members of your own ally and team is , how shall I put it politely , stupid, counter productive and sux !! OK ?

What other high tech qualities can you regale us with Abbott & Costello ?

2009-2-18 03:51 PM

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yasawakic
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Mengzhi:
Yes, such an accident is shameful if you want, because in such case the only meaning you see is "who lost face, who keep face."
More than shameful, I more worry about security problem: if the two submarine crash from the front, it's ok, bit if they had crashed from the side, we could have a nuclear alert in atlantic sea. 15000 tons even at low speed would certainely cause serious damages.

The only true about this case is that

1) We know very few about the truth because it is high sensitive secret information.

2) No these submarine are NOT ONLY INVISIBLE TO THE ENNEMY: They are invisible to the friend too, and even INVISIBLE TO ITS OWN COUNTRY TOO: EVEN THE PRESIDENT ignore where they are, even the french marine commander dont know exactly its real position (they only know approximately the zone where is the sub. The only exact equation is "keep invisible". This accident is surely intresting and maybe frightening, but certainely far beyond your sarcasm. (And dont think I support my country here, I 'm a true anti-militarist and pacifist)

3)How can two allies subs crash? If the classic attack subs sometimes training together, not do the nuclear missiles attacks subs: for the same sensitive reason, US, UK or Frenchies dont communicates about these subs. As this kind of subs must stay invisible, it has normally not scanning devices like attack subs, but only passive scan, wich seems have been blind each other. Probably, the two ships where in the same favorite place for submariners (some special depth where water density make subs more stealthy).
The stealth quality of these recent ship is not a legend, and a thing that must be said is that one of the reason of the end of the cold war, is that by the end, any USRR subs where easily detected by US subs, wich made USSR nuclear force obvious.

2009-2-18 05:37 PM

#15

mengzhi (mengzhi)
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The invisible subs.

yasawaki,

You have missed your calling as a fable confabulater , if you are not one already . Where do you learn this art of codswallop and myth making ? An honors student or professor you must be .

Re-read your own concoction and creative accounting , based on not an iota of acceptable conventional wisdom . Your rant and rave deserve a medal for patriotism ( or bed time story telling ). Keep it up . It is infinitely more interesting than the key-stone cops collision between two " invisible " friendly subs . Enemies of these nations need not worry anymore . At this rate , they will annihilate themselves , all by themselves . Hahaha .

2009-2-18 08:32 PM

#16

huang262
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Maybe they were chasing after the same mermaid.

This shows that the Brits and the French don't trust each other enough to share info, despite Herr Naive's hopes for Western solidarity

2009-2-18 09:37 PM

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yasawakic
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Mengzhi:
I just made a resumme from a very famous blog in france wich is from a retired high rank responsible in the army: 'secretdefense': because of having many relatives in the army, he has many interesting information, and his forum is well respected from soldiers themselves. I'm a little disapointed by your post because I dont see wehy my precedent post is 'myth making"These infos are just interesting, no? The cold war allusion was an element from a military analysis specialist. It is certainelynot objective, but is just one element in the cold war end.

I just mean that this accident is far more interesting than your college student-level humor..

2009-2-18 09:45 PM

#18

mengzhi (mengzhi)
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I respect your banter but the " way beyond the call of duty " effort on your part in defending the indefensible is just too laughable to pass .

No " stealth " planes or subs are in existence ! Get that myth and propaganda out of your mind . Last year a Chinese naval vessel alluded all detection by a US battle group around an aircraft carrier and surfaced in the middle of the " protected zone " mush to the shock and chagrin of the US .So there is no " invisibility " and no " impenetrable screen " .

I reiterate here that even if these two subs were deliberately assigned the task of causing a collision , it would have been difficult . You , and your " high placed defense relatives " should inform the powers that be that " invisible" vessels to members of your own team , is silly , tragic and stupid huh ? How about my shark cage proposal ? I am willing to offer that to the high commands free ,as a gesture of friendship and cooperation . Email me .

2009-2-19 05:06 AM

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betrayed
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Mengzhi said

So there is no " invisibility " and no " impenetrable screen " .

I agree with that, but I still find it a cross between scary and monty python

that 2 Super Nations can crash their best undersea weapons

and I do not know why

but it keeps itching at the back of my neck that it was not the fault of the French

add to that, both these weapons ( subs ) have incredible destructive power

and these people do not ( supposed ) know where they are

?

2009-2-19 05:19 AM

#20

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