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Could alcohol production be decisive factor? [Copy link] 中文

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Post time 2006-5-8 14:17:55 |Display all floors
I just had to write this is hillarious!!!

The beer that we are enjoying could just be the KEY to the next global economic giant!

Imagine, in petrochemical feedstocks.....
the basic ingredients are C1, C2, C3, C4 and C5 plus those pesky benzene rings!

Would it be..with all our tomfoolery and battle for crude oil....
and China and New Middle Kingdom quietly building up all those nice cassava, cane sugar building the basis of a new SUPERPOWER in our world! ha ha ha

afterall....alcohol production..China intends to be no.1...
and alcohol can make acetic acid....which produces PTA..or polyesters!!!!
what about coal....China has the world's largest coal deposit...she can get those pesky benzene make those plastics...

what if....China could get cost effective ways to use wood, plant material to make those alcohol from cellulose? make it cheaper than US$60 a tonnes?

ha ha ha ha ha

Amerikan Regime will pissed in their pants!!!!  ha ha ha

Green Dragon

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Post time 2006-5-8 15:23:04 |Display all floors

But there'd be no lock on that prosperity.

China's advantage is on low labor cost, and not  fertile land.  Brazil and the U.S. would have huge competitive advantage on that.

Unless:  unless there is technology involved, and China is the one owning the technology.  That's a pretty tall order, since hundreds of millions is being spent all around the globe to come up with  this time of technological advance.  China is not spending enough on such research.

Right now it is cheaper to import Brazilian alcohol than to make it in China.

Also, alcohol has only about 70% the heat content of gasoline, so the gas tanks have to be bigger.  It is also more volatile than gasoline (can you imagine that) and thus a tad more dangerous to use.  Existing engines are not well adapted to alcohol use - the hygroscopic fuel picks up water, which can be very corrosive.  Modified engines with better corrosion resistance (and thus more expensive parts) have to be developed.

Yes, all of those problems can be overcome and probably also mean new markets for China made technology.  But it also means that alcohol is unlikely going to be a total replacement for oil - at best it would be a supplement, to the tune of mayhap 5-15%.  No small change, but not 100%.

[ Last edited by tongluren at 2006-5-8 03:27 PM ]

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Post time 2006-5-9 10:24:07 |Display all floors

Reply #2 tongluren's post

Well, the low cost of production of alcohol in Brazil is mainly due to RAIN, LOT OF RAIN, low labour cost, low land cost......and use of the cellulose waste or mollasse to as fuel for the boilers!

It cost around US$90/tonne of alcohol...or about est. US$720/hectare cost...
selling at US$150 in normal time (or around US$20/barrel oil equivalent)...or total est. US$1,200. It could create a middle income nation. So we concentrate the planting in Thailand, Cambodia, Laos, Vietnam, Yunnan, Guangxi....(it is terribly wasteful to use maize!)

What if we could effectively use cheaper feestock to reduce cost to US$60/tonne...that would be equivalent to US$10/barrel oil at cost!....It would be cost effective...

but you'll probably need to have at least 15-20 tonnes of alcohol per hectare!

Hick! let's have a drink and get drunk! ha ha ha
Yup, Mr. Tong...i guess 5%-15% is all we need to keep the 65%-70% energy self sufficiency for our automotive fuel use!

Green Dragon

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Post time 2006-5-9 10:31:11 |Display all floors

Key engineering or genetics!

Higher yielding sucrose plants.....
Faster conversion to alcohol......more cost effective?

with easy to convert mollasses to be used for fuel for the distilleries?

Key technologies, the (1) MICROBES....super efficient microbes (2)HIGH YIELD BIO ENGINEERED PLANTS....with easy to chop up mollasses and easy to extract sugar content that uses poor land...something like the sugar cane with less hard cuticle surface.

Green Dragon

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Post time 2006-5-9 10:34:27 |Display all floors

and would i say land mass and water recovery systems!!!!

...would be more another 2 key!

shucks we only need maximum 100-150m T of alcohol....
and not all is imported.....
easy to harvest plants...maybe 1 man per 10 hectare...would yield income of US$12,000 per working man!

Green Dragon

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Post time 2006-5-9 10:37:52 |Display all floors

but its a long shot....ha ha ha

....but who is eco friendly?

but shit...what if we make "fuel cells"..successful....
and we can get H2 from nuclear plants, hydro electricity, geo thermal or even solar cells?

step by step is still safer...

Green Dragon

Note: Read this with some beer!

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